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Brighton Womble - Dont want another argument but I asked on the site for a disscussion on the subject of financing the club etc and TW has put his views over. It doesn't help when you say rather than posting on guestbooks e-mail the ideas to me. It would be nice to sensible open disscusion on here and lets hope in 2002 we can move on from the current infighting. Thanks.
Paul Raymond (webmaster@itmustbedons.com)
Tooting, London England - Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 23:39:19 (PST)
With regards to a national newspaper being involved in a ground I cant really see this happening as I cant imagine any paper wanting to be tied to any club even a paper like The Sun wont get linked into any club. I think the reason behind this is that if that club does well then fine but if not it looks bad on them also on something like impartiallity would they be allowed to do it? The Manchester Evening News Arean is different as it's a multi purposes venue and they are promoting it for the community. also most newspapers are in a bad financial state after commiting to large Internet adventures that didn't produce the rewards they expected.
Paul Raymond (webmaster@itmustbedons.com)
Tooting, London England - Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 23:32:24 (PST)
I think the only way the club can see through the next decade is to get a new home ground. I would rather see the team go bust than go to milton keynes. I will never ever go there, and i think it is nearly impossible to go back to merton. We really need some generousity from somewhere.
Joe P
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 13:40:28 (PST)
TW, instead of posting all that on guestbooks, mail me with your ideas. We'll see what we can do. E-mail below
Brighton Womble (brightonwomble@hotmail.com)
You might not believe it, but I'm actually more of a doer than a talker., - Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 13:31:26 (PST)
It's true, no sensible person would buy a club with no real collateral. Only a true supporter, with nothing else to do other than lose taxable income, would be remotely interested. Even if we found several multi-rich people would they risk their bank balance? But if we could get either a big company or a consortium interested there may be just a chance. Slim maybe, but a chance. say, for instance one of the national newspapers. With the right to have the stadium name, shirt sponsorship and everything else that goes with it. Something like the Manchester Evening News Stadium. It's very long odds but how about Daily Mirror Dons? (Don't start on me if you read another, it's just a suggestion).
TW
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 13:26:18 (PST)
Following from previous comments, if you are a millionaire, it implies you have a certain degree of business sense - buying into a club with few assets doesn't. I can already hear the cry of "well the Nogs did it", but we all know that they only bought in because they thought Dublin was on the cards. They speculated and have been burnt, but will anyone buy into the club knowing the state it's in?
Edinburgh Don
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 12:07:35 (PST)
Were coming..... Thomas Farleigh, isn't it.... ;-)
Boro Frontline
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 09:49:53 (PST)
Yeah, but after you buy a Club, it takes a damn site more than £20m to run the club for a season. I am sure you realise it is not just about the 11 players who pull on a shirt on a Saturday. Unfortunately football is a bloody expensive business. Even if we have 6 millionaire ST holders, I wonder if their families would want them putting vast ammounts of money in to something that wil not show any return, and will cost more than they invest. No club makes a profit each season.
Fosters Top
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 09:11:58 (PST)
OK might get me more stick but just think about this first. Last season Chesterfield was handed over to the supporters after they raised enough money to buy the club. But since then on atleast two other occassions the new people in charge have had to ask for huge amounts of money from supporters to keep the club afloat (needed about £1/2 million in short space of time just last month got £50k so were allowed to continue). People must realise that not only is it the funds to buy the club you also need a consistent cash flow to keep it running. Do people out their think it would be possible to keep the club running on that basis. Once again I'm not saying the fans couldn't run it (i would love it to happen) but it would be nice to have a good debate on here about this.
Paul Raymond (webmaster@itmustbedons.com)
Tooting, London England - Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 09:10:30 (PST)
Oh, and in case anyone is wondering - there are reportedly supposed to be at least 6 millionaires with WFC season tickets..
REPD again (http://www.sw19s-army.co.uk)
Still SM4, - Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 08:24:20 (PST)
FT - who will buy the club? Whoever wants it. ATM, the only people who seem to want to buy WFC are the fans. Now, can we afford it? The answer depends on how much the current owners want for it. If they still want £30m then they're (a) stupid, and (b) not going to get any buyer whatsoever. £10m? If QPR are worth £12m then WFC will definitely not be worth even £5m. Put it this way, if the asking price for WFC is in single digits (ie less than £9m), the fans are capable of putting at least part of the dough for that..
REPD (http://www.sw19s-army.co.uk)
SM4, - Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 08:22:48 (PST)
One thing REPD, who will buy the Club? As you rightly point out we have no assets so who will buy a Club losing in excess of £100k per week. And for those amatuer accountants who say it is a lie, if Forest have an average attendance of 20k, 14k more than us, are losing £100k then we are shafted. Who in their right mind will take this on????????
Fosters Top
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 08:10:51 (PST)
Forget point one. Just read elsewhere why they did it.Nice touch.
wiltshire don
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 06:48:32 (PST)
Two points. First one.Does anyone know the signifiance of Patrick and Jobi tapping two figures on the right arm of their shirts as they came off the pitch on saturday? Second one.If MK is a no go and the Nogs ain't going to coff up for a stadium in Merton anyone got any ideas who will? Can't see possible for a fans buy out.. not enough of us unless someone has got a few quid stashed away!!!!
wiltshire don
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 06:34:05 (PST)
Fosters Top - yes, if the Panel sees sense and says MK No Way then Koppout and co will act like the spineless idiots we know they are and try and ruin the club further. But can they? They can't asset-strip because there are no assets to strip. You can't actually sell players to cream off for profit (want proof? OK then, why don't clubs who are in financial shit do mass sell offs of players for money?) so what else can they flog? If it goes the way we want, watch the club go up for sale very quickly...
REPD (http://www.sw19s-army.co.uk)
Here, - Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 06:05:57 (PST)
Quick question... who are we going to watch next season when the arbitration rules out a move to MK? 'Cos sure as sure as hell we won't be watching WFC as we know it. I get the feeling WFC will fold. 19 players out of contract, major redundinces on the way if arbitration fails for CK. A skeleton staff will remain, and top players sold be fore deadline day. The club will have died very slowly infront of our eyes by the Barnsley game. This will be a painful few months people. Unless we have to finda benefactor or a minimum of £100m before April!!! What chances? THANK YOU MR HAMMAM, YOU REALLY CARED ABOUT US!!!!!!
Fosters Top
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 04:24:49 (PST)
If anyone responsible for distribution of Y+B wants to
e-mail me, I may have some info which you might find interesting.
Edinburgh Don (edinburghdon@yahoo.co.uk)
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 03:44:24 (PST)
Jimmy - you forgot to mention the hook where my left hand should be - go on admit that you find it attractive! BW - I didn't mean reading this guestbook alone - however, I know for certain, that some people who work in the 'communications' dept do regularly view all the Dons websites. As for drinking coffee Ronan, I thought that was the pro-Dubliner's drink in days gone by? ;-) Good win yesterday though, any thoughts from anyone on the performance?
Edinburgh Don (edinburghdon@yahoo.co.uk)
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 03:41:38 (PST)
With regards to attracting non football people to the situation regarding Wimbledon I think this is where The Dons Trust will come in. I think the "It's a Community thing" flyers were very good and I think that residents need to learn about the good things of a local club in their area rather than reading reports about abuse being shouted at people. It is a lot harder to get good stuff reported in the media but it will do a lot better in the long run. Hope people understand what I am saying and dont just shoot me down.
Paul Raymond (webmaster@itmustbedons.com)
Tooting, London England - Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 03:02:00 (PST)
BW, I used my perogative ie: I changed my mind. But I'll go back to what I said, let's stop bickering and see what we can all come up with to help our club. I'm sorry BW but you cause more arguements than any other. Use that energy with us to see what more can be done. We've all written our letters to the F.A., the League, The Minister for Sport and our local M.Ps. We've joined in with the WISA organised events, some have joined in the spontaenous protests etc. etc. What else can we do. Let's have some fresh ideas, not rehashes of what's been done but new and novel things. We need more to catch the general public not just football people.
TW
- Sunday, December 30, 2001 at 02:40:45 (PST)
TW, I thought you'd stopped posting (see earlier). Have certain of you maybe considered that the owners of WFC ltd hev rather more shitty things to do than read this guestbook. We argue, there's nowt wrong in that. At least we talk, and not fight.
brighton womble (brightonwomble@hotmail.com)
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 17:34:24 (PST)
Hey, I drink tea. Want to call me pro-MK to my face?
REPD
:), - Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 11:49:23 (PST)
ED - Typical - I KNEW all you pro-MK people drank tea. Everyone knows REAL wimbledon fans drink coffee. Wibble.
Ronan (rgwarde@ukgateway.net)
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 11:24:13 (PST)
Edinburgh Don, you got a glass eye with a goldfish in it. You got a peg leg with a kickstand.
Jimmy Kimble
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 10:15:45 (PST)
That's better everyone, we'll be round eachother's houses for tea and biccies soon if this keeps up! :-) A good point made by ? (sorry I've forgotten!) that the Nogs would find all the infighting very amusing. Off to the Edinburgh derby now, hopefully to see Hearts wipe the floor with Hibs!
Edinburgh Don
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 05:00:42 (PST)
You can't get out of this one, Real Hash. I remember you working in the Palace shop when you were six - you used to help your brother out (he's the biggest Palace fan I've ever met).
Jimmy Kimble
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 04:55:15 (PST)
a few things, firstly...I am 17, and so I was 6 when we moved to Selhurst (could I work in a shop when I was 6???). Secondly...I use to support Man U, not Palace. I was converted to the Dons by my brother (who is a lifelong don)when I was 12. Thirdly...if MK was to be given the green light, I would support 'The Real Wimbledon FC'.
The Real Hash
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 04:30:06 (PST)
I was at the pub with 'The Real Hash' in October and he said if the club goes to MK that he would support either Portsmouth, Southampton or Palace. I think he used to support Palace - I know he used to work in their club shop at Selhurst before the Dons moved there.
Jimmy Kimble
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 02:12:39 (PST)
Quick bit of gossip for you, hot off the press: 'The Real Hash' used to support Palace - mate of mine sold him a signed Mark Bright poster a while back.
Stuart Stone (cort_carl@hotmail.com)
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 02:02:57 (PST)
TW - gladly accepted. For those who didn't get the joke - the concept was I had top secret information vital to the runnings of the club - but would only show it to my most personal friends - or perhaps I just wanted to use the chance to indulge in some weird sexual fantasies involving male football fans and a gents toilet. Either way - it was a crap joke! Roll on PNE - here's to seeing Agye and Nowland up front, slotting in a hat-trick each.
R (rgwarde@ukgateway.net)
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 01:44:12 (PST)
Ronan I apologise, my remark was made following your explanation to prove the conspiracy theory. As not everyone has seen that they won't understand. Although I failed to see the humour I accept that's what was intended and gladly withdraw my comment.
TW
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 01:09:16 (PST)
At last some sense. Ed Don, I don't wind people up, I just try to bring out sanity. The bickering is damaging the club. I tried being nice (Seasons Greetings) that fell flat so I tried to open things up. We're all on the same side but we seem to be at each others throats, why? Nobody is perfect and everbody has a right to an opinion. Take the idea that employees should resign. People need to pay rent etc. And does that request apply to the players? Of course not. Look at the boycott of club merchandise. How do these people get into the match, is there a secret free entrance? Surely the game is a product of the club? See how the extreme can taken. My reference to how many years I've followed the Dons was to show that I'm still here so I still care, not that I'm a better supporter. I don't decry WISA in any way, just the outpourings of some of the members who get their wires crossed and thus spoil the real aim. So for once we all seem to be in agreement, let's stop the bickering and get down to some serious exchange of ideas as to what more can be done to prevent our club being stolen. Here's to three points today and a Good New Year to all.
TW
- Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 01:04:31 (PST)
So there you have it adult offering by Ronan am looking forward to a constructive response. Equally you could try postign your concerns to a fellow memebr of the WISA Committee or a newly elected member of OWFF. Contrary to some opinion i do not actually bite nor am I in the habit of hitting people, foul and abusuve language I make an exception for in cetain cases hence my statement in the Yellow & Blue for Watford!!!
Perhaps some on here may care to join us tomorrow when once again we shall be hitting the people of Wimbledon and Merton (metaphorically) with the campaign to save the only thing we all appear able to agree on? Details on WISA Chat or in this weeks Wimbledon News.
Certain unamed womble (seanphilfox@aol.com)
Noorf Laandan, drunken - Saturday, December 29, 2001 at 00:54:16 (PST)
I give up. After repeated attempts to improve the relationship between people like myself, and others who I used to speak to on a regular basis (like Paul and Chris) - it still results in a few people who like stirring the $h1t. Stu - the conspiracy about the evil club shop staff getting the game called off WAS supposed to make you laugh - the conspiracy theories went wild - obviously you were blinded by your distrust of me - Paul can supply you with the details of my 'proof' - hopefully you can see the humour in it. I said you were unlikely to find support - but some people do support you - 2Shirts being an example - I didn't say you would find no support IIRC. FWIW, over 400 registered users signed into WISA chat on Friday - just not everyone posts - or registers. The WISA site averages 40,000 unique visits (2 million hits) a month - so somebody is reading it. And as to why I'm thought to be in love with my own hand - I've no idea where that one came from - perhaps it could be explained? Re: all this WISA stuff - anything I post here or on WISA chat is personal - it no more represents the official line of WISA than this site does of Wimbledon FC (Holdings) Ltd. So don't take it out on WISA - take it up with us personally if you so desire. And if you don't like our opinions - join WISA (or OWFF) and elect someone else at the next AGM. TW made some interesting points (apart from hand comments) - can we change this discussion to why what WISA are doing is bad - and hopefully change it - rather than just slag each other off. I am interested in how the fans are adding to the demise of the club.
R (rgwarde@ukgateway.net)
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 18:18:17 (PST)
er no TW. You said, and I quote...'the first time that the fans have helped the demise'. Now to me, that means that the fans are helping Wimbledon FC die. And that is completely false (yellow and blue, fans united, its a community thing- postcards, leaflets, local ads etc, WISA protests and stadium plans, dons trust) and since u have shown no sign of changing that belief, I think you are a complete muppet (the politest thing I can think of).
The Real Hash
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 18:14:17 (PST)
Two points. 1) A very good point made by Wilts Don. 2) Stu - I have always backed you up and I'm a regular poster on WISA as many people are aware of (won most posts of the month award in September 2000), so I would just like to ask you to retract your last statement.
2Shirts (webmaster@sowimbledon.com)
Tooting, London - Friday, December 28, 2001 at 16:44:47 (PST)
This is aimed at Ricko and Wibbly Don (and Edinburgh who seems to talk sense)as most of the rest of you seem to be more content at slagging each other off than anything else.I know its a very passionate time at the moment but all the same,what a shame.Why do you need a guestbook to call each other names, why not all get around a table and sort it out one way or another and that way perhaps we might get some more interesting, less personal postings!!!If the Nogs read some of these sites they must be killing themselves laughing at all the in house fighting. Anyone remember the saying united we stand, divided we fall.Anyway,thanks to Ricko and Wibbly Don for taking the time and trouble to respond to my posting.It gave me a bit more of an insite to things.It worries me as to what will happen if the ruling goes against the Nogs as not too sure where that will leave us but it would be nice to think if they don't get their own way they really would look seriously at a local option. Hope and all that!!!!. Oh and Ricko, yes you are right some 1st Div clubs do "survive" on smaller crowds than us but only one or two and they don't have our squad size.
wiltshire don
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 16:00:44 (PST)
Personal abuse gewttign out of hand hmm i'll say so lets cvondemn the usage of it by all not just one then shall we?
Cetrain unamed womble
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 14:55:29 (PST)
Here we go again. I thought we were all on the same side? TW - you sure know how to wind people up don't you?! Obviously, the divisions amongst the fans are going to speed our demise, and some people are getting a little TOO carried away with themselves, but if we all keep up the campaign (I mean the letter writing, Fans United type things, MP lobbying etc. NOT the abuse of club employees), we might just get somewhere.
Brighton - what was all that b*llox about freedom, and responsibility, what?! Listen to yourself man! I agree with some of the more constructive posts on here, but the general 'I'm a better fan than you' nonsense is just getting out of hand (not Ronan's I hasten to add!!). Several people, myself included have voiced concerns about the possibility of us getting home, we have NEVER said "OK, lets chuck it in and go to MK" and I haven't stopped writing to and e-mailing people. However, it seems if you don't agree with some people 100%, you just get slated. Pack it in, the lot of you, I thought I had left the playground years ago.
Edinburgh Don (edinburghdon@yahoo.co.uk)
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 14:11:36 (PST)
Point proven! Not once did I say that the fight against MK was wrong. I tried to point out that the petty bickering was damaging the club. Any neutral reading such messages would assume that WFC has a following of moronic bigots. I was asking for reasoned discussion, not the brow beating that is very apparent. As for BW, I've said before I do what I do without boasting. Did you ever se Tony Hancock's "The Blood Donor."? The one where he kept a little book of all his charity donations so that he could remind people of what he had given. A parody here? Perhaps one day they will have a patron saint of underprivilleged football supporters. As for the post asking me to eff off (couldn't be bothered to read the name), another who proves my point. We don't like what you say so *********. I'll say it again GROW UP.
TW
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 14:00:28 (PST)
Ronan, you really make me laugh!!! The reason I will never find a resonse backing me up on WISA chat is because the regular 15 of you lick each other arses!!! FACT!!! I dont lose any sleep over your comment anyway, you lot just get the arse because I have the balls to question some of your points. I keep forgetting that I have to tow the party line and say yes sir, three bags full sir. Ronan, as for calling someone knob, that was to Junior Don and I hink that was quite tame. As for you having proof for the club shop responsible for the game being called off is huting me laughing!! I wish we were that popular but that has to be the romour of the decade. Ronan, to be honest, I have no time for you at all. I had no time for you before this MK buisness and I certainly have no time for you now after what I have found out about you. Just before I get slagged of again, I will say that it is just personal to Ronan and not about WISA in general, who I have as much time as possible for the 1500+ members, its just certain individuals. Oh yeah, Brighton Womble, Paul wasnt after a medal by phoning people from WISA and Y & B, he was being kind. I even told him he was stupid after all the abuse he has had. One thing I know bout Paul, is that this divide is really getting to him, but it just seems people enjoy intimidating him, which I find really sad.
Stuart D (stuart@sdeacons)
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 13:58:26 (PST)
So I hide away behind a logon, I have no objection to anyone knowing who I am and since you asked my name is Sean Fox ands i am certainly not afraid to tkae on the blood suckers who are killing Wimbledon Football CLub. For the record I am an elected memebr of the WISA Committee and also of OWFF you want to know what I stand for read my election address. As for people making comment about WISA Committee members and refusing to stand by or back up their allegations, this could be viewed as mud slingin of the worst kind.
Oh and I do not expect a reasoned response to that after all petty comments such as grow up and being in love with your left hand appear to be the responses of people who don't like others challenging their beliefs.
certain unamed womble
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 11:57:29 (PST)
go for it BW. So TW, if the fans are helping the demise, then kindly explain what exactly yellow and blue is, what exactly WISA is (and what they have done with regards to PL, photo shoot, bus tour, protests etc) and what exactly all those letters, faxes and e-mails that have been sent are. You really do not know what u are talking about. I suggest you either take your words back or explain them properly because you have just made a complete idiot of yourself. You do not know what u are talking about.
The Real Hash (some fans really make me wonder (and yes I do mean you, TW))
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 11:48:29 (PST)
I presume you stood around during Dublin, before the move to Selhurst, when merger with Pal@rse was threatened? My God, and you say I need to grow up and get some intelligence. Brain of a three-year-old.
Brighton Womble (brightonwomble@hotmail.com)
Sorry Paul, it has to be said., - Friday, December 28, 2001 at 11:35:08 (PST)
TW, I make no apologies for saying this, but why don't you eff off. This is the first time supporters have stood up to the bullying of WFC Ltd. As for you watching more games than the rest of us, I couldn't give a damn. There are people who've hardly been watching them for a couple of years and they still do more than idiots like you. I'll say one more thing; thank God it's not you leading the fight to save the club. With supporters like you doing it, we'd all be stuffed.
Brighton Womble (brightonwomble@hotmail.com)
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 11:33:28 (PST)
Chris, I walked past you a) because I barely know you. Situtations like that are difficult. Besides, I was with Kris when you stopped and talked to him down the road from the the club shop in SW19. I also have suggested to a few people here that some of you meet me for a drink at any time to have a chat about all this stuff.
b) I have never suggested that you simply walk out. I have spoken to people about this and always maintained that you should look for another job and only leave when you've secured one. Except you don't seem to want to. As for the part-timers, everyone here knows my views on those who don't NEED to work in the club shop. What I find interesting is that most of the critics of people who continue in the employ of the club are quite prepared to explain their views, but those who try to defend it always end up citing some old ancient right to freedom of conscience. Yes, but with freedom does come responsibility and sometimes you have to make sacrifices for the greater good. And no, I'm not a communist, just someone who believes that we should pursue this common aim united and not selfishly.
Brighton Womble (brightonwomble@hotmail.com)
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 11:28:45 (PST)
fans have helped the demise??? so Fans United Day, all the protests, yellow and blue etc etc are all just part of my imagination then? Not to mention the countless letters, faxes and e-mails. You have gone too far.
The Real Hash
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 11:07:14 (PST)
I know I said I wouldn't post any more but I can't help this one last message. STOP IT! You're doing more harm than good. You must know the old saying "United we stand, Divided we fall." As for Ronan, stop making love to your own hand. Brighton Womble, when, and only when, you grow up and become intelligent then you can speak. We're losing our club but certain people, misguided as they are, are speeding the decline. Stand up together, stand as one, then we can win. Until then we are losing. I've watched more Wimbledon games than most of you have had hot dinners and believe me this is not the first time our club has been threatened but the first time that the fans have helped the demise. Good luck and God speed but this is really the last time you'll hear from me.
TW
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 10:46:17 (PST)
Wiltshire Don- an attempt to answer your questions. Why should we expect the Norwegians to cough up xxx million to take Wimbledon back to Plough Lane? They knew when they bought Wimbledon that we did not own a football ground. In fact, they've admitted that they bought us on the back of the Dublin relocation plans. Since then, things have gone pear-shaped for them. That's very regrettable but doesn't mean that they should be allowed to set a very dangerous precedent by moving a football club 70 miles away from it's home because they want a free football stadium. So far they have done nothing to show to us that Merton is their first choice. It was WISA that proved that Plough Lane was workable- Koppel admitted that he hadn't even LOOKED at it. The only thing they've done is look into the Greyhound Site, using the same company which will build the stadium in MK. Although they promised to, they have not released the full report into the GS publicly. Why should they have to contibute money towards building PL? Apart from being the richest men in Norway, they have not shown any evidence that they have contacted possible investors that could help finance a stadium in Merton. WISA pointed them to a potential investor with a personal fortune of £12bn and they failed to follow him up. Have they gone to Safeways and looked into the possibilities of a commercial package which would reduce the cost of the stadium? (the Safeways Stadium?) As Koppel admitted that he had not even looked at Plough Lane, despite saying he's looked everywhere within the M25, I have my doubts. If the richest man in Norway is not willing to invest any money in a new stadium, why exactly did he put forward an application for planning permission for a new stadium on PGPF?
Why are we aiming protests at Charles Koppel? He has lied to us time and time again 'fans will be fully consulted before a final decision is reached' 'all talk of Milton Keynes is pie in the sky. We are a London club and will remain so.' (Gjelsten) 'we have investigated everywhere within the M25' 'we will publicly release the results of the GS study' He also pocketted our season ticket money BEFORE revealing the news about Milton Keynes. If I was convinced that he was seriously looking at Merton, it might be a different story, but I am not sure at all that he is.
What's to stop the Norwegians asset-stripping (selling all the players and selling up) From what I understand (I may be wrong- I've just been told this by people that claim to know about these things.) you cannot asset-strip with players, only with grounds.
Realism- I don't know how many fans we'd get at Plough Lane. I EXPECT that gates would not decline. Already other First Division clubs survive on lower gates than ours. We'd get more people at MK? Why? MK has a population of around 250,000 people. Merton alone has a population of almost this number (not including Wandsworth, Sutton etc which adds up to a LOT more people than there are in MK.) Also, there's a natural fanbase in and around Merton. Fans in MK already have their own teams (Arsenal, Spurs, Northampton, Luton, Rushden and Diamonds.) Would more than 7000 fans turn out in MK to watch MK Dons play against Grimsby on a wet Tuesday night? The only way I could see MK being a financial success would be if we were in the Premiership. And we were getting gates of 16-17000 at Selhurst in the Premiership anyway!
Ricko (theangrybear@hotmail.com)
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 09:28:55 (PST)
Right- from the off, I'm a WISA Committee member. This does NOT mean that I think I'm more of a fan than anyone else. And I'd like to make it absolutely clear that I do not support any intimidation of club shop staff. The boycott- it's WISA policy so I support it. Constitutionally, our members are able to call for a review of it and change this policy if they disagree with it. I, along with Lee, organised Fans United Day and received many helpful and supportive comments from Paul. We completely sold out one block in the Arthur Waite (1500 seats) and may have sold out at least another of the same size, although I'm not sure of this. The event was a success in general, I think ( reps from over 90 different clubs attended.) There's a limit to how many people are going to travel the length of the country to pay £18 to save a football club that isn't even theirs. The main thing is that we showed that there is general support in the football world for our cause and that it is a national issue. The Plough Lane design was featured in national newspapers and on the television and we had very favourable write-ups and coverage from The Daily Telegraph, The Guardian, Reuters, London Tonight, ITN to name a few. If anyone has any complaints/ whatever about WISA or Fans United Day, please feel free to e-mail me. I like to think that I'm approachable and that I value comments from WISA members and Wimbledon fans in general.
Paul's a mate and a bloke I've always really respected. He's stood by me through some hard times and I'm not about to lose him as a mate over any of this, especially as I know that he's a true Don and on the right side. In terms of working in the club shop- I may have done things differently but I've never been put in that position and the main thing is that it can only ever be a personal decision. Likewise, I also regard Chris and Stu as mates and Dons fans. It's important that we all work together and do not divide ourselves. The views of Dons fans to MK has been illustrated by the election of 7 out of 7 anti-MKers to the Official Wimbledon Fans Forum. Some of the people who voted for these 7 may have issues with WISA. This is very regrettable. As I said before, if you've got any problems, get in touch with me at the address above or anyone else on the Committee. You WILL be listened to.
Richard McGregor (Ricko) (theangrybear@hotmail.com)
TW, - Friday, December 28, 2001 at 09:00:21 (PST)
jools: know the full facts before you say something. PLOUGH LANE IS NOT TOO SMALL FFS. Are you blind? Are you deaf? Are you completely ignorant? Have you been living on a different planet for the last 4 months? I will say it in easy English...IT IS NOT TOO SMALL. WISA have proven that a 20k rising to 25k (Bolton have a 25k stadium, so do Charlton, I don't think Ipswich's is much bigger, Leicester's certainly isn't)stadium can fit on that site. They consulted stadium designers who are experts in this field (unlike you, no offence). And let me tell u some things about sam hammam...he tried to take us to Dublin. Do you remember? He tried to merge us with Palace and rename us the Selhurst Sharks. Do you remember? He turned down 3 sites in and around Merton. Do you remember? Not to mention the stories of us being moved to Cardiff, Belfast, Man City. Do you remember? He sold Plough Lane and ran off with the money. Do you remember? Obviously not.
The Real Hash
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 08:30:43 (PST)
FFS.
Why is everybody slagging each other off? You're all as bad as each other by picking out only what you want to hear and going a 'tabliod' just so you can have an arguement.
CK is the one we're having a go at - why can't you all have civilalised conversations with each other? We are supposed to be one of the most intelligent set of fans in the country you know.
2Shirts (webmaster@sowimbledon.com)
Tooting, London - Friday, December 28, 2001 at 08:03:47 (PST)
BW - You've said it again! "Actions speak louder than words". Well why haven't you answered CD's question/statement down the page then, eh? (Scroll and read, you know you want to.....)
Very Pissed Off Don
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 07:23:06 (PST)
Woe to anyone who disagrees with the mighty Brighton Womble. He's on the WISA commitee and is the world's greatest Dons fan you know......
Alan
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 06:49:44 (PST)
I'm talking about the owner's ambitions, not the fans ambitions. I'd be extremely happy with a ground in Plough lane - I could see it from my bedroom window and get up at five-to-three on a Saturday afternoon instead of going to hellish Thornton Heath. Unless a multi-millionaire fan buys the ground I just don't think Plough Lane will be chosen as a suitable site. Its not that I don't want the club there, its just that I don't think any current or likely prospective owner will want Plough Lane.
Jools
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 05:50:14 (PST)
Brighton Womble, well said, I agree with your comments totally re the size of a new stadium, FFS,if we had a 25k all seater stadium this to me would be the dogs bollox, BRING IT ON HOME
Wibbly Don
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 05:46:17 (PST)
Stu, apologies for not reading your post properly. Paul, unfortunately, in your blinkered world, you see absolutely no contradiction between what you say and what you do. Actions speak louder than words.
Brighton Womble (brightonwomble@hotmail.com)
USA - Friday, December 28, 2001 at 04:07:41 (PST)
Jools, what's ambition? Is ambition winning European Cups or staying in the top two divisions? Is that ambition to be met at any cost? One of the problems facing our club - our supporters, is that we have been given SO much success that it seems to have gone to our heads. You don't get Crewe planning a ground with European football in mind. We're a similarly supported side, maybe bigger and even if we are going to get back into the Prem, what about Bolton, for eg? 25 000 all seater. Millwall, the same. HOw 'big' are we? Paul, I don't really think that you guys at the club shop want us to move to MK, but you really don't do yourself any favours continuing to be there whilst the club tries to crap on its fans and now goes through arbitration. No amount of phoning WISA people to tell them games are off as a 'favour', giving up website domains or other is going to make me see any differently. I have already told you that I believe you are dishonorable and hypocrytical, that's enough. I'm just sorry that supporters have to disagree in this way, but that's the position we all find ourselves in, I'm afraid.
Brighton Womble (brightonwomble@hotmail.com)
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 04:04:09 (PST)
Brighton Womble - I mean its too small. And it is. No owners with any ambition for the club, Norwegian or otherwise, are gonna shell out for a small-ish stadium on a cramped site.
Jools
- Friday, December 28, 2001 at 02:34:52 (PST)
Brighton Womble, Stu doesn't have a go at fans united if you read his post but some people want to believe that people in the shop wanted fans united to fail and hope that MK goes ahead HOW WRONG YOU ARE but in your blinkered world you wont accept anything else.
Paul Raymond (webmaster@itmustbedons.com)
Tooting, London England - Friday, December 28, 2001 at 02:19:04 (PST)
Jools, what do you mean too small for a stadium? How on earth has WISA come up with a professionally designed 20 000 plus all seater stadium on the site? I wish people would LISTEN FFS. And as for Fans United, no surprise that Stu from the club shop puts the mockers on it. You make your position even more untenable with every word you utter.
Brighton Womble (brightonwomble@hotmail.com)
- Thursday, December 27, 2001 at 17:59:07 (PST)
Hash - email me and I'll tell you
Ronan (rgwarde@ukgateway.net)
- Thursday, December 27, 2001 at 05:37:16 (PST)
fair enuff Paul, sorry for my error or judgement. Ronan- evidence?
The Real Hash
- Thursday, December 27, 2001 at 04:08:28 (PST)
To The Real Hash/Junior Don or whatever you want to be called this week. For your information I was in the offices getting stuff for the shop and as soon as we were told the game was off I phoned up about 15 WISA / YELLOW & BLUE people to let them know rather than make them come over to Selhurst and then find out and rather than just going home we kept the shop open till 12:05 so that we could explain to people that the game had been called off.
Paul Raymond (webmaster@itmustbedons.com)
Tooting, London England - Thursday, December 27, 2001 at 03:51:11 (PST)
Wibbly Don, With regards to the grant I think we are only talking a couple of million pounds but yes I agree that with the £25 mill that was put aside for a ground we would have a starting point. The club always knew that PGPF would never get planning permission for a stadium even Merton Council have rulled it out so if that was the route they were taking it was a dead end. With regards to the 12:00 kick off IT WAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE CLUB the met police say that all games on boxing day must kick off at 12:00. I think the last time palace played at Selhurst on Boxing day they played Sunderland and that was a 12:00 kick off as well. The Sunderland coaches left at 00:00 and got to Selhurst at 07:00.
Paul Raymond (webmaster@itmustbedons.com)
Tooting, London England - Thursday, December 27, 2001 at 03:46:16 (PST)
Ronan. I agree with Stus reasons for working in the club shop. All Wimbledon supporters are good friends of mine - no matter who they are or what they do.
Anyway - that game was probably going to be the one that turned our season around, but now we'll have to wait and see if Preston is on or if we have to play Portsmouth to turn both games around. IMO a lot harder games then Watford would have been at this stage in the season.
Warren (webmaster@sowimbledon.com)
London, - Thursday, December 27, 2001 at 03:20:59 (PST)
Wiltshire Don, glad to see that at least you saw a game of football yesterday, what a disgrace re Selhurst pich, sabotage? bad management? whatever it is par for the course at the moment with Koppell etc, now back to your question, it has been stated on more than one occassion by the Nogs that they have 25m to spend on a new stadium within the Wimbledon or surrounding area, that along with, and I stand to be corrected which I probably will be, a grant from the Sports Council along with various other money spinning ideas should at least have WFC and Safeway talking, but as we all know Koppell is only interested in one place, Question!!! where was Koppell going to find the money for a new stadium at the Prince George playing fields if Merton Council had given him the go ahead??.
The postings seemed to have mellowed slightly now, must be the season of goodwill or something
Wibbly Don
- Thursday, December 27, 2001 at 03:18:54 (PST)
Wibbly, sorry I didn't know I was mocking Junior Don. He like everyone else is entitled to his own opinion which some people who post on this website should remember.All I thought I was doing was stating some rather hard facts.Which incidentially I would still really love someone to give me an answer to the questions I put forward on my previous post. Is it noone read it or noone has an answer to it?
What a surprise yesterday's game was called off. I expect the Selhurst ground staff don't exactly work up a sweat to get our games on. Another reason to get away. Still gave me the chance to watch a local Conference game, Forest Green v Yeovil. Cracking game had everything you don't often see in league games, effort, committment and passion.
wiltshire don
- Thursday, December 27, 2001 at 02:54:21 (PST)
Well, it has all kicked off again - this time on different forums/guestbooks. In just 24 hours Stu D. went from saying
"....I never ever swear or insult people personally on the Internet...."
to
"Pope.......One word for yuo KNOB!!!!!!!!!!" (sic)
Stu - give it a rest mate - you are unlikely to find people who agree with you on WISA chat or WWW regarding your reasons for working in the club shop - if you fancy an argument - annoy somebody else and go to the 'Come and have a go' section of the Palace rivals board. Oh, for the record, my conspiracy theory regarding club shop staff being responsible for the game cancellation is absolute fact - I have proof - and am willing to show the proof to whoever asks, except Stu - just so he can feel even more paranoid. Now, back to football. Will the missed game help the team performance or make it worse?
Ronan (rgwarde@ukgateway.net)
- Wednesday, December 26, 2001 at 18:45:50 (PST)
Paul: since you are always in the club offices having chit chat with the people who would like to see our team murdered...next time, why dont you ask them why the pitch has not been covered for the last week?
The Real Hash
- Wednesday, December 26, 2001 at 16:06:52 (PST)
All praise and worship to Mr. Raymond for ringing people up and telling us the game was cancelled. Hundreds of texts/phone calls made as a result - and lots of wasted journeys saved.
Ronan (rgwarde@ukgateway.net)
- Wednesday, December 26, 2001 at 04:19:38 (PST)
Wibbly Don, you want to slow down a bit my friend, you are going to get all hot and bothered in a moment!!! So I should get of my arse then should I??? Well I am quite happy and content with my support of my club, I dont need you or anyone else to get 'of my arse'!!! I never slagged anyone off anyway, well accept REPD but I will come back to that. I am a realist im afraid, I would love to be optimistic, but I have had many a bad weekend when the support has lacked my own anbitions. Sorry but thats life. If you want to dream of having 18000+ average figures then you do that but I live with stats not dreams. As for Phillo, what is your point??? He decided he could no longer act as a representative for Wimbledon. Big Deal. I like Phillo and have know him for many years and remember meeting him at away games in the early 90's. He asked me to resign when this all started and I told him clearly that I do things how I see it and not to be worshiped!!!! I wish Phillo would come back to the PA as he has his own unique style which was superb to listen to, I even used to get into the ground early so I could listen to his tunes. And I know he was looking forward to using the new sound system at Selhurst, but the timing of the MK issue stopped that. As for Fans Utd, you should read my post again and then come back to me. I never slagged it off, just pointed out that it still only attracted 1000, that granted mainly due to the ticketing system, but I would never slag it off as I could imagine the time and effort spent by many friends I have in WISA. JUNIOR DON - I understand what you meant and I appologise if I mis read what you said, I still however stand by what I said. REPD - Respect you for your honest opinions. The only problem I have with you is that I never ever swear or insult people personally on the Internet and that is what really bugs me with you. I dont regard you as a WISA committee member but If you want to slag of Mr Davis, the marketing team or the Club Shop ( Not saying you have slagged us in the shop BTW, just an example) please do it to there faces, you might get more respect and interesting responses.
Stuart D (stuart@sdeacons.fsnet.co.uk)
- Tuesday, December 25, 2001 at 09:39:11 (PST)
Stuart and Wiltshire, Do not mock Junior Don, I agree with his sentiments, perhaps he has just got the numbers slightly wrong, Stuart if everyone had your attitude we would have even less fans, I along with many more are aware that we have a small fan base in SELHURST but FFS can you blame us it is a shithole, if everyone did their little bit ratehr than just say we have a small fan base then it would look far healthier, I am very surprised by your comments re Fans United, this was an excellent effort by the few who IMO achieved a lot so dont knock it get behind it and finaly if not buying the official programme or indeed anything associated with the club speeds up the procees in anyway to get Koppell out then I will do it, so rather just say we have a small fan base, what good was Fans United etc, get off your arse and do what Phillo has done and support your club stand with us hand out leaflets sell Y&B but do not knock the people who are commited to ousting Koppell and returning the Dons back to Plough Lane, or are you happy with what Koppell is doing, What a staement by Terry Burton re the board at long last he is starting to see the light they are murdering our club, why should we be their accomplaces
Wibbly Don
- Tuesday, December 25, 2001 at 06:57:33 (PST)
Edinburgh, thanks for you comments.Stating facts as hard as they are is being realistic not disloyal.Well there's you,me and Stuart who seem to share a fairly common ground.What I would love is for somebody to tell me is why they expect the Nogs to cough up £xxxx millions to take Wimbledon back to Plough Lane.Everyone agrees they have no love for the club so why should they put their hands in their pockets for the benefit of c5,000 football fans with little or no prospect of getting a return on their money?The protests etc have to be done from a profile point of view but the protests and name calling are aimed at the very people we are expecting to cough up!!! I'm sure someone much clever than me will put me right but what's to stop the Nogs selling all the players that they can get anything for to recoup some of their cash and then simply walking away. Where would that leave us? OK I know I might be a little too logical and level headed to post on a football web site but if someone can please give me answers to my questions I would really be very grateful.
wiltshire don
- Tuesday, December 25, 2001 at 06:22:35 (PST)
I was on the way back to Wimbledon on Sunday evening when I stopped at a petrol station on the A3. When paying for my petrol I saw an old bloke staring at the car sticker in my rear window - a 'take the Dons back to Plough Lane' sticker. This bloke came into the shop and joined the que behind me, and when I turned around I saw it was Sam Hamman. I taked to him for about 15 minutes about various things - he'd seen the Norwich match the day before and agreed that Kelvin shouldn't have been sent off. I then mentioned to him that Plough Lane was almost completely gone and he was surprised having not been there for two months. Anway, he signed some stuff for me, we shook hands and I went home. I decided to stop at Plough Lane on the way home to take some photos of the rubble and to try and get inside, but when I got there the security guard wouldn't let me in. Then who turned up but Sam Hammam, who hassled the guard for ten minutes until he would let us in. His duaghter came in with us as well. We talked for ages about the ground situation - I was critical of his reasons for selling up the team and the effects it has had on the club. He was obviously concerned about the situation and was genuinely gutted about the state of Plough Lane, calling it his 'baby' and his daughter said that he has had the old centre circle put in his front lawn and various bits of the stands in his back garden. He went on to talk about various things that happened in the old days of Wimbledon FC, leading up to winning the FA Cup whilst operating out of an £800 portakabin office. By the end of it he was almost in tears. It seemed that he regretted selling up and was really unhappy about the club's current situation. He agreed that Milton Keynes wasn't the best option but thought that Plough Lane was unsuitable due to its size, and having been inside for the first time in ages I have to agree. He got his daughter to take a couple of photos of me and him standing together in the rubble where the pitch used to be, and then as we left he gave the security guard a wad of cash as thanks for letting us in. The point I'm getting to is that although loads of the longer serving Dons fans tend to slag off Sam on occassion for numerous [valid] reasons, the guy still has a genuine passion for his old club. The fact that he came to the Plough Lane after I mentioned that it was almost gone, and that he was prepared to get me in there and spend almost an hour chatting on a freezing cold Sunday evening with his wife waiting in the car shows just what a genuinely nice bloke he is. I have my own views about Hamman, and I really wish he hadn't sold up the club, but the guy's a geezer and I wish him all the best at Cardiff.
Cue loads of replies along the lines of 'Hamman is a sell-out cash-greedy fat c**t'...
jools
- Tuesday, December 25, 2001 at 05:45:19 (PST)
I see that the season of goodwill doesn't extend to football guestbooks. I agree with much of what Stuart D and Wiltshire have said. We all agree it would be fantastic to return to Plough Lane, and nothing would please me more - I just can't see where these thousands of 'lost' Dons fans are to come from. As one who used to stand on the terraces at PL, I remember that our crowds only ever got into double figures (of thousands I mean!) when Man Utd, L'pool, Arsenal etc visited. Why are people being slated for being realistic and saying this? Eventually, I would hope our crowds would increase, but to start with, the 18,000 estimates are wildly optimistic. Some fans are disappearing up their own arses, and think they are bloody Che Guevara! How can you be so pious to suggest that people should jack their jobs in? Lets put things into perspectiv; we would be devastated if we lost our club that we all love, but it is a football club. Nothing more, nothing less. If you think that you should risk your living and the security of your family over it, and berrate others for not doing so, you need to take a long hard look at your life. Happy christmas everyone, and lets hope we can finally put MK to rest in the new year.
Edinburgh Don
- Tuesday, December 25, 2001 at 05:22:21 (PST)
Stu: I think you have got completely the wrong end of the stick mate. For a start, you didn't just say I was optimistic, you said i was living pon 'cloud cuckoo land' which I see as a bit rude. Secondly, when I said 'its people like you who hold us back' what I meant was that the last thing we need as Dons fans at the moment, is pessimism (spelling?). And if u read my previous post clearly in the first place, I did not say we will sell out every game, I said OUR FIRST GAME will be a sell out, and after that it will be a case of persuading people to come back. If all our fans had your attitude of 'oh, we wont get any more fans. It will just be the same crowdwise as selhurst' (not saying u used those exact words, but that was the general jist) then we will get absolutely NOWHERE. As for you continuing to work in the club shop...I dont like it, I wont lie and say I dont care. I completely dissaprove of it but at the same time, one we have won the war against Koppel and the NOgs, I would rather people like you are working there than some nobodies.
Junior Don
- Tuesday, December 25, 2001 at 05:16:40 (PST)
Anyone had any Cadburys Cream Eggs This Easter Yet? :)
Paul Raymond (webmaster@itmustbedons.com)
Tooting, London England - Tuesday, December 25, 2001 at 02:54:32 (PST)
Stu - It would be a shame if I got a spell checker it would take away the fun of trying to work out your posts :) Ronan - Dont worry mate I was only joking about you being steaming at Norwich but I would hope so after memories of last years Limo Trip.
Paul Raymond (webmaster@itmustbedons.com)
Tooting, London England - Tuesday, December 25, 2001 at 02:53:32 (PST)
Stuart - so I have a chip on my shoulder. Yeah, suppose I have really. Many people know I have not bought a single bit of WFC merchandise since 1996, so this ain't a new thing. You don't respect me? Fine, I don't actually have a problem with you per se, never have done. I'm actually quite amused that I'm seen as a troublemaker on behalf of WISA. I definitely haven't seen many new shirts being worn, maybe people are buying them and just not wearing them until this shit is killed off once and for all, but I can only speak as I find. Pathetic and embarrasing? Fine, I can live with that accusation, I've had worse thrown at me. Coincidentally, can I just point out that I am not a WISA committee member, have no desires to become one and I seriously doubt if I would get voted on even if I did stand. And that's me being honest about myself. Anyway, merry xmas...
REPD (http://www.sw19s-army.co.uk)
Last word from me on this BTW unless you want to really make an issue of it, - Tuesday, December 25, 2001 at 02:39:48 (PST)
Ronan, I understand what you say, but if we at the shop constantly moaned about comments from people from WISA ( and I stress it is only certain individuals) then we just be accussed of being sensitive or picky. As I said in previous posts I only have respect for yourself, Lee, Marc Jones, Mikey T and Chris S. But other members just are plain pathetic and an embaressment to WISA and our Club. Thats one thing I have sadly learnt since this plan to wreck our club was announced. I will continue to speak to the above WISA members I have stated but I will no longer treat the other members with respect and will talk to them like they talk to us - LIKE SHIT I seriously wish WISA members and Dons Fans a very MERRY CHRISTMAS and HAPPY EASTER
Stuart D (stuart@sdeacons.fsnet.co.uk)
- Tuesday, December 25, 2001 at 01:39:10 (PST)
Stu - if you have a problem with particular WISA or committee members, who are saying things on behalf of WISA (and only three people have the right to do that) - for gawds sake say so - to WISA. As has been pointed out - various things have been said about everyone - and for the record, I did not go on a rampage ringing up club shop staff, (and other staff) calling them 'c' words. Even though this was entered as a complaint to WISA.
An example was the recent post on the OS where somebody claimed he got an email from WISA threatening violence - but although Kris requested a copy - he has yet to receive it. In terms of us getting death threats - yes it does happen - with even photos being sent to prominent members. All I can say is to repeat what I have always said - this battle is bigger than individuals - and I just wish those who take pleasure is stirring shit stop it. Whilst all this goes on, OUR club is dying - and we need to fight for it's survival in what ever way we think is right (and of course my way is right, and you are all wrong ;-)).
Merry Xmas everyone - and keep your livers ready for the day the arbitration panel tell Roekke to get stuffed.
Ronan (rgwarde@ukgateway.net)
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 16:52:54 (PST)
Paul - sorry if I am hogging this tonight, but just have to repond to Junior Don. If it people like myself who have been holding the club back as you say then you must do a hell of a lot yourself. I have missed at the most 40 games in 10 years home and away, season ticket every season, sponsered players kits for the last 4 years. You are typical of comments I hear. What makes you better than me??? - NOTHING - What makes me better than you?? - NOTHING. I throw good money after bad into my Club, proberly like yourself, but I never ever slag someone of for their view!!! I purely pointed out that maybe you were being a little optermistic. You say that the lads who have boycotted Selhurst will come back - how many do you reckon that adds up to??? You say that the pure high profile of the move will attract new fans - Just dont see how that stands up! With all due respect to WISA and everyone - Fans United day was high profile - but it still only atracted what 1000 at the most, which was great and I was proud that they come to fight for our club. But we are dealing in small number here compared to the ones you think we will get. What do you think our average attendance will be for our first season back at Plough Lane. It was what 9000+ as a Premiership team in 1991 - so what figure will we get for a Division One team in 2003?? I want a serious discussion on this one with no slagging off ( or is that why you are called Junior Don?)
Stuart D (stuart@sdeacons.fsnet.co.uk)
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 16:20:17 (PST)
Oh shit, my spelling is really bad, sorry lads now you know what I mean by me being as thick as shit!!! Paul - when you going to get a spell check on this site!!!!!
Stuart D (stuart@sdeacons.fsnet.co.uk)
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 16:08:06 (PST)
Oh this guestbook is getting fun!!! REPD - you really have a problem dont you???? I always laugh how you call people these names and insult them but go into your shell when you come face to face with them!!! One thing that I am proud of from myself, Chris and Paul is how we have no resulted in abusing, calling people names and god knows what else we have had to put up with. I still have many valued Dons mates who respect what I am doing and know full well my feelings. I HAVE NEVER, AND WILL NEVER PROMOTE MK, AND ALL I DO ON MATCH DAYS IS SELL MERCHANDISE TO DONS FANS WHO REQUIRE THEM - SIMPLE!!!! Ronan - What upsets me the most is how you have clearly admited that you have listened to other people about what Chris has said than actualy listen to him. Diference between me, Chris and Paul is that I dont really lose any sleep if I dont speak to yourself, or whoever wants to slag me off. It just doesnt bother me, Im stronger and above all that. I openly went into the Farley on Fans United Day and brought Y & B and made it quite clear that I supported the boycott. Funny that the people I know and respect in there knew that and made jokes. The others just stared and tried to make me feel uncomfortable. I have for many years spoke to Lee Willets ( Sorry about the spelling), Xavier, Mikey T and others and they are decent blokes and have never been rude or arrogant towards me, its the other lads like REPD and others who just have a plain chip on thier shoulder, who I believe just enjoy causing trouble because they have nothing else better to do. Sorry if I offend but thats how I see it!!! Regarding Merchandise, lets put facts on the table, it is never going to make a profit anyway, it is purely their to provide goods for fans needs. I have no problem with the boycott and will never have a bad word to say about it as I understand the issue. But, When REPD says that he doesnt see the new shirts anymore, well that is pretty obvious!!! The sales are more or less in the same trend as last Xmas from what I see on Matchdays, just people are more discreet!!! We get loads of 'have you got a plain bag' comments which we dont laugh at and just provide them with a White bag. But I have long since stop being bothered about stares and threats after games, which WISA say is no longer done. Well sorry WISA, but come and be a fly on the wall and you will be shocked by some of the anticks of your committe members. Now thats my honest view, Im always available for chats at all home games, I dont bite and I actualy listen istead of thinking I know everything, because people who know me, already know that Im a thick shit anyway.
Stuart D (stuart@sdeacons.fsnet.co.uk)
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 16:04:46 (PST)
There's something wrong with your MOTM voting for the Narrich game. I can't seem to vote for David Nielsen! ;o)
And after that nonsense can there really be any doubt that Wimbledon Football Club is being deliberately and incompetently run into the ground to drive fans away and ease the move and renaming to Milton Keynes?
Martin Drake (martin_drake@hotmail.com)
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 10:23:42 (PST)
Paul - it was a bit hazy - wasn't sure if I had just shook hands, or did a big drunken 'I lurve you I do' male bonding type hug thing.
Ronan (rgwarde@ukgateway.net)
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 10:00:22 (PST)
Ronan fair point you do always do say hello and we have a laugh by the way do you remember chatting to me on Saturday or was it a bit hazy. And I'm sorry to let you know that the shop has done brilliantly this christmas. One thing I am sure that you would agree on is the fact that once this is all over you would much rather have people like me, Chris and Stu in the shop than people that dont care about the club. (And people please dont say if we cared about the club we would resign) Anyway Merry Christmas.
Paul Raymond (webmaster@itmustbedons.com)
Tooting, London England - Monday, December 24, 2001 at 08:12:06 (PST)
Chris - regarding the walk past - I did actually say hello to Paul on the day - but due to the recent crap that has been spread around about you and I, I thought it better if I just steer clear of you - and let sleeping dogs lie. I always say hello to whoever I meet that works for the club - even have a friendly banter going with Thorley these day (although we totally disagree about things!). Paul can confirm I always say hello. I had wanted to make a humerous joke about you not offering us a lift as you drove past on the way to Forest, but wasn't sure if it would be taken in the manner intended (boycott club travel anyone?). Don't get me wrong though! - I still think both of you should resign - how is the job hunting going? ;-) Merry Xmas everyone (except Koppel, Roekke etc.)
Ronan (rgwarde@ukgateway.net)
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 07:57:08 (PST)
Sorry for all the spelling mistakes
Wibbly Don
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 06:44:21 (PST)
Wiltshire Don, absolutely no offence meant how could you be pro MK after so many years, again on a similar line as Junior Don I agree we ued to get 8 or 9k in Plough Lane but I feel strongly that should we return or when we return I think that there has been so much strong feeling since th eMK thing started that everyone involved would want it to be a successs and bring mates along to a game, also if there are shares in the new stadium, great presents to give and encourage fans to go and see what they are involved in there are a million things to do to encourage people to come and see the Dons and be honest would you want to invite anyone to Selhurst,I feel that a return to plough Lane WOULD put a few thousand on the gate, in the meantime keep buying yellow and blus and boycott the WFC merchandise come on everyone do a little to BRING THE DONS HOME
Wibbly Don
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 06:42:32 (PST)
TW - Well done mate. Appreciate the comments and it's a shame that people have ruined it for you. BW- Lucky I don't have a conscience then, innit?! However, I do have a car to pay off, rent to pay and xmas presents to buy. How, in the name of all that is holy, do you expect me to pay for them without a job? REPD - No need to be personal in this IMHO, I'm sure Reg feels the same way about you, we all know you have a problem with him, so let it GO!! CUNW - yes, it's great your anonymous, but lets have your name on there, or are you worried that the clubs' gestapo will 'get' you? Come on fellas, old debate, same answer. You do what you've got to do, and we'll do what we want to do because, lets be honest, we don't have to explain ourselves to anyone, do we? It, as you guys have said a fair number of times, it's OUR CHOICE!
CD (tfi2@hotmail.com)
Wimbledon, Actions speak louder than words BW? Then how come both you AND Ronan walked past Paul and Me the morning of the Forest game without saying a word? That action certainly spoke volumes to me! - Monday, December 24, 2001 at 05:47:43 (PST)
TW - personally attacking Reg Davis by calling him a "prick"? Well it's not just me who thinks that TBH about him. The guy is supposed to be the PR guy or something, yet he has totally the wrong attitude towards people in general. I know for a fact that during the Dublin protests he said that most of us had no right to protest because we were all johnny-come-latelys etc, and that WISA et al were "whingers". I first dealt with him in 1985 and he was a smug arrogant git even then. Even if he was an ordinary employee, I would still find it worrying that somebody as clearly sarky and obnoxious as he is still employed by WFC. The fact that he's a public voice of WFC goes a long way IMHO why our general image is so shocking. Is that me being "arrogant" or scraping the bottom of the barrel? No, just a humble opinion. I'll go away now.
REPD (http://www.sw19s-army.co.uk)
SM4, - Monday, December 24, 2001 at 04:52:50 (PST)
TW, any employee of WFC Ltd who has a conscience should resign, yes. Sometimes, in the interests of the greater good - in some cases of democracy itself to take a wider context - people have to make uncomfortable decisions that might cause hardship.
If I was in the position of opposing MK and working for WFC Ltd? I'd have been looking for another job. It shows the unfortunate fact that people are too often selfish beings where sacrifice is the more honourable option. The scandal is that they fail to see it.
Happy Christmas.
Brighton Womble (brightonwomble@hotmail.com)
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 04:13:22 (PST)
Stuart - football has boomed in the time we have been away from Merton fact! we have done little/nothing to attract new fans fact! we have been a league club for 25 years fact! we have been away from our community (however small) for over half our time as a league club fact! what do people expect? support takes time to build - in an area of competition for fans like we are in with so many London clubs you HAVE to try and attract new fans! why do we not give away 10000 (yes 10000)free tickets per game? Sunderland do it - because they want the next generation to be Sunderland fans, it is obviously not as simple as that for the dons but these things take time to build and we have never bothered/had the chance to do this!...............also our squad is made up of nearly 40 players - the average squad in div 1 is about 27/28 - we are paying too many players fact! also what people seem to forget is that we are essentially a 2nd div club who have had some brilliant years, we seem to be levelling out now but need a platform if we are going to build again
Hutch
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 04:05:19 (PST)
I have tried to be seasonal but it appears to be a waste of time. Since 1960 I have never known a time when Wimbledon supporters have been so arragant that they refuse to discuss any subject without being downright rude, ignorant and full of bullshit. Everyone is entitled to an opinion without being verbally attacked. I am totally against MK but REPD you stoop to the bottom by personally attacking Reg Davis. He is working for an employer. What's he to do? Resign and lose his job just because you disagree with the Norwegians? Would you leave your job if the company wanted to do something you disagreed with? If you would you are both naive and stupid. This is the last time I shall bother to post on any football site. This country is a democracy and I defend that right but will not tolerate the nastiness that is coming from some so called Wimbledon Supporters.
TW
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 02:55:40 (PST)
Wibbly Don,I hope you are not suggesting I am pro MK as if you are I take great offence in that. If Wimbledon move to MK its not Wimbledon anymore and I will simply take up following my local non league side full time. I was merely pointing out the facts however painful they may be. Apathy has always surrounded the Dons. We may get a few more people going if we managed to get back to Merton but I don't think enough to support a 1st div club. Charlton had a reasonable fan basis to return to we haven't. What was the average attendance when we left Plough Lane, 7000/8000? Current average leaving out away fans must be 5500/6000.Do you think there are 2000 people waiting for the Dons to return to Merton? As I said before the Nogs bought a PL side perhaps to show off to their mates and most certainly to get a return on their money. The only way they will now make money is to get back into the Prem League and that means investing in players which doesn't seem to be happening so what does that suggest to you? A wait and see game? I bet if they get the OK to move to MK money will be invested in players to push for the PL as again no PL can't see citizens of MK rushing home from work mid week to watch ??xxx?? v Grimsby(no offence to Grimsby).MK might not cost them anything ground wise but would still have to find money for wages so PL still vital. If they don't get the OK I can't see them hanging around. Either way, we the fans lose. Sorry but that's the way I see it and from someone who has stood along with 500 others at Plough Lane in the bad days in the Southern League so please don't question my love of the club. On the other issue of the moment.Perhaps the Neilsen saga showed exactly the depths we have reached. I was not sorry to see him go to Norwich as I have never rated him (thought about saying so last week but afraid my words would come back to haunt me...how come he scores from a header when with us he was incapable of heading a ball as he could never time his jumps right?)but totally dumb struck when found he was allowed to play against us.The last few days just about sums everything up doesn't it?
No matter how fed up I'll still be leaving home at 8.30 on Boxing Day to get up for the game. Are we mugs or what!!!!
wiltshire don
- Monday, December 24, 2001 at 01:53:57 (PST)
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